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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 2:05 am Reply with quote  
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  Caedus_16
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Dog-Poop_Walker wrote:
Jedi Joe wrote:
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Padme, that's almost exactly what one of my sons told me today when he got back from it -- minus the Jar Jar screeching lol. But after what Lucas had to say about 3D, I'm not all surprised with what I'm hearing.

Anyway, I'll be seeing it next weekend when one of my other sons is here.

If anyone's interested, here's the Lucas on 3D article. http://is.gd/kn608H


I'm 100% with Lucas here. 3D truly adds artistic value to the movie. Call it a gimmick if you may, but just remember, color was also a gimmick in the Wizard of Oz...


While that is no longer the rule, it still holds true. Jaws, Godfather, Taxi Driver, Star Wars, Pulp Fiction, The Dark Knight.... Most of the great movies of the last 40 years would be just as good in black and white.

Which 3d movies would be just as good in 2d? None that I have seen so far. Only time will tell but considering that 3d has been around for the last 40 years too, it's record so far isn't going good.

But I'm old school and I'd rather have a Hitchcock over a Cameron. To me what makes a great movie is writing, acting, score and cinematography. Special effects are just icing on the cake and when CGI is used instead of any of those things I am not impressed. That's what separates Christopher Nolan from Michael Bay.


Actually almost all are as good in 2D because they are using 3D as a gimmick and not as something to add depth to the picture so there is no point to the 3D. And the Dark Knight would have been nearly unwatchable in 3D, as dark as it is if you didn't have color to separate characters from one another. I agree on a couple of your movie choices there, but Star Wars also would have been awful in black and white. Lightsabers would look like gray blobs and etc.

I agree that Hitchcock's films are more classic than Cameron's, but he also had less available to him. Plus its not fair to compare Hitchcock to Cameron, a more reasonable comparison would be comparing him to Nolan or to Shyamalan (a good example and a bad one). Michael Bay just needs to have his film license revoked for a few years...
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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 3:45 am Reply with quote  
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  Dog-Poop_Walker
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Caedus_16 wrote:

Actually almost all are as good in 2D because they are using 3D as a gimmick and not as something to add depth to the picture so there is no point to the 3D.


You make a good point, and that really sums up the whole thing to me. The real difference between an innovation and a gimmick. So far 3d just makes things pop out at you, it rarely if ever makes for a totally different viewing experience than in 2d. You are right again when you said the difference in B&w and color. For most movies, and most of the ones I named there isn't a big difference in the two. But for some movies,yes, like Dark Knight color is intentional and important to the movie and it really wouldn't have the same effect without it.

I'd like to see 3d develop into that because it has the potential to be an innovative thing. But you have to make a different movie, a movie that is designed to utilize 3d (really Avatar I think is the only one) and not just take a "regular" movie and make it 3d.

Hitchcock would be a good comparison to Shyamalan or Nolan. Cameron would be a good one to Bay. The difference is that Cameron still makes good movies, unlike Bay for the most part IMO, they are just movies that use visuals to tell the story more than any of the other elements of a traditional movie. I prefer the traditional, but that's a matter of taste.

This is getting real off topic, but I hope it did address some of the things people were thinking about when it comes to Star Wars movies and 3d.

If I seem usually critical of things Star Wars it's because I love Star Wars and movies and Sc-fi, and I'd like to see all of them combined to their best.


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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:14 am Reply with quote  
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  Queen Padmè Skywalker
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It seems to me that films that use 3D to the fullest suffer in other areas because so much focus is on the effects. I'm thinking about Avatar, here. It was a beautiful looking film, but I felt the story and characters were flat and boring as anything. I watched it at home on DVD and struggled to finish it.

Back to Star Wars, I'm most excited to see Revenge of the Sith, mostly for the Battle of Coruscant in 3D.
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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:38 am Reply with quote  
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  Jedi Joe
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Caedus_16 wrote:
Actually almost all are as good in 2D because they are using 3D as a gimmick and not as something to add depth to the picture so there is no point to the 3D.


Every 3D movie adds depth, so I don't get what you're saying. The gimmicky aspects are when they throw stuff at the screen and it's virtually useless to watch the same movie in 2D.


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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 11:19 am Reply with quote  
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  Mara Jade Skywalker
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Alright, so Padme and I basically agreed that we would disagree on the 3D. Honestly, I thought it was pretty much nonexistent. For a company the likes of LucasFilm, I was expecting depth such as that portrayed in Tron: Legacy. I saw no such depth. The opening crawl was incredible, because of course they utilized it there. I was mesmerized. CGI Yoda was also given a depth of field, understandably because he was new material anyway. But it seemed as if they didn't touch anything they weren't already going to change. Don't misunderstand me, I didn't want lightsabers popping out of the screen and podracers coming into the seats. I just wanted to see a difference. My sister acquired 2D glasses for her birthday (they reverse the effect of the 3D), and they work very well. Turns any 3D movie into perfect 2D. Well I tried them yesterday during the movie, and I saw little difference. *shrugs*

Anyway...! That aside, as that was the least of my reasons for wanting to see the film. I just felt I could have paid a little less. So I'm going to start off with things that were kind of like...AWESOME:

1. CGI Yoda (the best thing Lucas has ever changed)
2. Qui-Gon Jinn!
3. Darth Maul
4. Battle Droids/Destroyer Droids
5. Coruscant
6. Jedi Council
7. 3PO!
8. Sebulba
9. Watto
10. Jawas!

So I'm sure most of you will disagree with much of my list. But let me just add one more list and then I shall discuss. So things that were kind of like...AWFUL:

1. Jar-Jar (he was worse than I remember)
2. Slapstick (be subtle George, it worked in the 70s and 80s, it can still work now)
3. Neimoidians
4. Anakin's friends
5. Yippee

Details:

CGI Yoda was fantastic! Couldn't have asked for a better change to the films. Really put my mind at ease, that. I never realized how awesome Qui-Gon is! Obi-Wan was always my favorite prequel character, but Liam Neeson totally makes that film. I am a new and utterly devoted Qui-Gon fan. Smile

Darth Maul was, of course, incredible as always. I tried to imagine myself seeing the double-bladed lightsaber for the first time, and yes, it was awesome. The droids! They really were incredible. The battle droids that folded out and were so emotionless? Awesome. The destroyers that could roll around and then unfold into a calculating machine of death? I was in awe. Coruscant! How about seeing the city planet for the first time? To see it in theaters was breathtaking. Loved it! The Jedi Council was totally awesome. I tried to imagine coming from 20 years with no Star Wars and seeing a Jedi Council...it was just kind of awesome. 3PO made me smile! Just loved having him there. I once heard someone say that it was dumb that Anakin was building a droid for no reason. Uh, let's see...because he wanted to?! Love 3PO. Smile

Now onto some debatable pros. I loved Sebulba! He was just a really good antagonist. I don't know why, but I enjoy his character. Watto! Absolutely love Watto. He's incredibly acted, probably some of the best acting in the film next to Liam Neeson, and I just love that he hovers around like an annoying insect. Really appreciated his character even more after the viewing yesterday.

And last but most definitely not least, Jawas! I forgot all about them, and when they yelled out "Utini!" during the podrace, I cracked up laughing. That's the kind of humor George is supposed to employ. Not Jar-Jar. Sad

Which brings me to the very awful! Jar-Jar was horrific. I actually enjoy The Phantom Menace, but I must admit I actually found myself frowning at certain scenes with Jar-Jar. He's so unnecessary and horribly overdone. I used to be an advocate, claiming he was humorous to an extent and didn't ruin the film. I have since changed my stance and am a proclaimed Jar-Jar hater. He ruined every potentially decent scene he showed up in. Final battle? Gungans could have been awesome. Enter Jar-Jar! Gungans were laughable. Oh, George. Sad

Related to this was the incredible wealth of slapstick. What was George thinking?! I remember Empire with it's amazingly subtle humor scattered throughout. Hilarious! Phantom Menace? Cringe-worthy humor sprinkled everywhere. Sadness.

I don't really know what to say about the Neimoidians. They were just...bad. Maybe it was the way they talked? I just think they were bad characters to use for the majority of the film's opening. Disappointing.

Anakin's friends were sad. The acting was so bad it's a wonder how it got into the movie. I like Kitster, I really do. But I was sad when Anakin's friends showed up. Sad indeed.

I used to be an advocate of "Yippee!". This is because I was once babysitting a 7 year old boy, and he asked permission to do something. When I told him he could, he shouted "Yippee!" and jumped into the air like Anakin. So I found it realistic. What I do not find realistic is the fact that it was said 297 times! I never realized how often it was used, I thought it was only said once. Neutral

Finally, I must comment on Jake Lloyd and the storytelling of TPM itself. First off, Jake Lloyd. The kid was adorable and a great actor for his age. I'd like to see any of us do that well as a child. He really did an amazing job, and I hate the fact that he gets so much flak. I love the fact that he plays Anakin. He's cute, and personally I think he pulls it off very well.

Storytelling! The story of The Phantom Menace is really very complex and praise worthy. It was hidden beneath a layer of embarrassing material such as Jar-Jar and bad dialogue, but the story really is Star Wars worthy, in my opinion. Midichlorians can be debated, of course, but that aside, I think it's great prequel material. So I do give George props for that.

And before I go away bashing the 3D, the movie was incredibly crisp and beautiful to watch. They definitely cleaned it up. So I'll give them points for that. Anyway, didn't mean to be so longwinded! Overall impression: Originals beat prequels any day of the week, hands down. But there really are some great things about the prequels. Smile
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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 11:32 am Reply with quote  
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  Jedi Joe
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Mara Jade Skywalker wrote:
Watto! Absolutely love Watto. He's incredible acted, probably some of the best acting in the film next to Liam Neeson, and I just love that he hovers around like an annoying insect. Really appreciated his character even more after the viewing yesterday.


Watto's awesome! My sister absolutely hates it when I say "No, they WON'TAH!" in a Watto voice. Definitely one of my favorite characters, for sure!

I liked the long-winded review , that part just stood out to me, haha.


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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 11:39 am Reply with quote  
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  Caedus_16
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Jedi Joe wrote:
Caedus_16 wrote:
Actually almost all are as good in 2D because they are using 3D as a gimmick and not as something to add depth to the picture so there is no point to the 3D.


Every 3D movie adds depth, so I don't get what you're saying. The gimmicky aspects are when they throw stuff at the screen and it's virtually useless to watch the same movie in 2D.


Some add depth, some look like cardboard cutouts standing in front of each other and it looks less like depth and more like a poorly produced puppet show. And the stuff flying out at you doesn't do anything for me.
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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:01 pm Reply with quote  
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  Taral-DLOS
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I watched TPM in 3D last night, and there were a few things that jumped out at me in particular (not literally, I mean they drew my attention).

Holograms: in 2D, they look cool and semitransparent, but the added depth in the 3D made them feel insubstantial too. They looked SO COOL

Space: The scenes in space looked awesome, but what looked amazing was any time you were in a spaceship and looking at space through a window. The depth there made you feel like you were looking THROUGH A WINDOW INTO SPAAAACE!!!

I also really liked the details on the CGI aliens, like Jar Jar, Watto, Boss Nass, Sebulba, and Yoda.

Loved it loved it loved it. Can't wait for Episode II (my favourite of the prequels)!
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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:14 pm Reply with quote  
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Caedus_16 wrote:
Some add depth, some look like cardboard cutouts standing in front of each other and it looks less like depth and more like a poorly produced puppet show. And the stuff flying out at you doesn't do anything for me.


Well, trust me, Star Wars was no cardboard cutout puppet show... Wink


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 PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:45 pm Reply with quote  
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  Caedus_16
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Jedi Joe wrote:
Caedus_16 wrote:
Some add depth, some look like cardboard cutouts standing in front of each other and it looks less like depth and more like a poorly produced puppet show. And the stuff flying out at you doesn't do anything for me.


Well, trust me, Star Wars was no cardboard cutout puppet show... Wink


After reading reviews from Taral and Mara I'm psyched and think it'll be worth the ten I'll spend Smile
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 PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 11:58 am Reply with quote  
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Double post, apologies.

Ok so I saw it last night. Decent film overall this time, and my friend thought so to and its in no small part because of both of our reading Darth Plagueis before seeing it. The background political information eased a lot of the plot of the film, which is rushed (I stand by my statements: TPM could have been the best of the films if not for several things, one pacing issues).

The Good:

* Liam Neeson is once again a capable actor who doesn't give this role all he has, but gives it more than Lucas asked for I'm sure. In fact I'm more sure after rewatching AotC last night that he doesn't require much of a performance to impress, but Neeson gave one anyway.

* The podrace has some of the extras shots that were added to the dvds and blu-rays. I love this section of the film because of the graphics combined with the first real sport or recreational activity shown in the Star Wars universe. Its not all unrealistic amounts of wars again and again and again guys!

* The look of the landscapes. No two shots showed more depth or immersion in reality than when Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan were descending into the lake or when the bongo surfaced at Theed. Also, the Coruscant skyline in 3D was mind-blowing in a couple shots.

* Watto, Sebulba, and Yoda. The graphics on these guys were better and to be honest I loved them. Great sharpening on them and I couldn't have been happier.

* Darth Maul is scary as heck sometimes. The fight with him was outstanding. In fact in this lets include that whole segment because the Space Battle looked incredible and so did the lightsaber battle.


The Bad:

* Jar Jar. No I will not get off of this one. This is the most pathetic moment in Star Wars. Jar Jar is annoying, embarrassing, and kiddish to the point where kids next to me were complaining because he was stupid. The humor was reminiscent of the 3 Stooges, not Star Wars. He ruined almost every scene he was in. He could have been an acceptable character if he hadn't been just so...so worthlessly stupid and 'Waaaaackkkyyyy!!!" (I'm guessing that was Lucas's intention: wacky).

* Some, not all, but some of Jake Llyod's dialogue and delivery. Everything he said while inside that Naboo Fighter should have been rewritten or cut down to just him freaking out because all it did was sound forced and terrible. That and his "yippee". Good lord. His lines where he was attempting to be sarcastic in Huttese were annoying when I was young and slightly now because they felt awkward, but I would find a kid his age being that sarcastic about death odd anyway. However, in his situation its understandable. I didn't mind him for the most part, and my friend and I both agreed he was less wooden that Hayden Christiansen.

* The pacing. This movie, as I've stated before, could have been the most astounding of the saga. I don't mind politics if you make it interesting and give all the information, and I don't mind some of the way it was done but the movie is on fast forward till they hit Tattoine, and even then they kind of gloss over it a bit. This was a 3.5-4 hour movie jammed into 2.5 hours. A good try, but the whole thing could have been so much better.

* The Nemoidians! Mara was right! Lucas spent hours making Sure Watto, Jar Jar, and Sebulba had CGI mouths so that their movements matched their words. Why then did he get cheap with the makeup on the films villains? Good lord...


The 3D:

* Gorgeous. Layered, deep visuals instead of gimmicky stuff flying out at you. The film was beautiful, and I'll be seeing the rest without hesitation.


You'll enjoy this if you love Star Wars, if you want to see how 3D should really be utilized, or if you just want something to take the kids to in order to introduce them to what you got to enjoy since you were old enough to watch movies.
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 PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 7:40 pm Reply with quote  
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  Queen Padmè Skywalker
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In Jar Jar's defense. several kids in the theater I was in laughed at his scenes. That said, I hate the little Gungan monstrosity.

I wanted to throw in my opinion on Natalie Portman's performance. I have to say, she was excellent as Queen Amidala. She had a gravity and fire that really impressed me. One of my favorite moments is when she's addressing the Senate and is interrupted by the Nemoidian representative. The way she holds herself aloof and just slits her eyes in his direction is awesome. Now, that said, I feel like so much time was devoted to getting Amidala's dialect and presence correct that her performance as Padme suffered. It was almost liked Natalie didn't get a lot of direction during those scenes. I don't think she was terrible, but I think she could have been warmer, as opposed to the almost monotone she uses in some scenes, which works when she's Amidala, not so much when she's Padme. All that said, I do love the exchange with Qui-Gon: "Are you sure about this? Trusting our fate to a boy we hardly know? The Queen will not approve," "The Queen doesn't need to know," "Well, I don't approve," I really like the slight whine in Padme's last line there. It's kind of the only moment in the film when I'm really aware that she's only 14 years old and under a lot of pressure.
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 PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 9:11 pm Reply with quote  
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  Mara Jade Skywalker
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Something I forgot to say. We went to an afternoon show, so there weren't too many people there. Though everyone did clap at the end, which I thought was a nice touch. However, when we left the theater at about 6:30, there was already a line for the night showing. And who was first in line but Darth Vader and General Grievous! Cool

Grievous was a little kid, and what my sister regrets not saying was, "General Grievous. You're shorter than I expected." Very Happy
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 PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 9:23 pm Reply with quote  
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Queen Padmè Skywalker wrote:
I wanted to throw in my opinion on Natalie Portman's performance. I have to say, she was excellent as Queen Amidala. She had a gravity and fire that really impressed me. One of my favorite moments is when she's addressing the Senate and is interrupted by the Nemoidian representative. The way she holds herself aloof and just slits her eyes in his direction is awesome. Now, that said, I feel like so much time was devoted to getting Amidala's dialect and presence correct that her performance as Padme suffered. It was almost liked Natalie didn't get a lot of direction during those scenes. I don't think she was terrible, but I think she could have been warmer, as opposed to the almost monotone she uses in some scenes, which works when she's Amidala, not so much when she's Padme. All that said, I do love the exchange with Qui-Gon: "Are you sure about this? Trusting our fate to a boy we hardly know? The Queen will not approve," "The Queen doesn't need to know," "Well, I don't approve," I really like the slight whine in Padme's last line there. It's kind of the only moment in the film when I'm really aware that she's only 14 years old and under a lot of pressure.


This.

I totally forgot to mention it but TPM is Portman's best performance in the prequel trilogy. She acted her part beautifully and the hints were subtle towards her true identity. It was all well crafted. In fact she might be coming away as one of the best parts of the prequel trilogy if I don't count the next two movies she's in.
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 PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 10:33 pm Reply with quote  
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  Queen Padmè Skywalker
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Mara Jade Skywalker wrote:


Grievous was a little kid, and what my sister regrets not saying was, "General Grievous. You're shorter than I expected." Very Happy


Shocked We should have said that! Didn't even cross my mind.
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