Log in to check your private messages
Mara Jade Catsuit: Fanservice run amok?
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The EUCantina Forums Forum Index » The Expanded Universe: Literature & Media View previous topic :: View next topic  
Mara Jade Catsuit: Fanservice run amok?
 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:39 am Reply with quote  
Message
  Dancelittleewok
EUC Staff
EUC Staff

Joined: 15 Sep 2010
Posts: 1170
Location: Kansas

According to Club Jade, a cat suited Mara Jade Skywalker t-shirt might be a possibility for Her Universe, a clothing company designed for fangirls by a fangirl. I don't see how a cat suited Mara Jade would appeal to the targeted female audience other than it's Mara Jade Skywalker. No matter what she's wearing, Mara Jade will still remain a popular EU character. But is the catsuit really necessary?

Thinking about this, I wondered how men vs. women are visually portrayed in the Star Wars media. Aalya Secura, Ahsoka Tano, Mara Jade Skywalker, and especially Darth Talon wear little or tight clothing. Padme Skywalker has more variety: she's worn heavy, multi-layered clothing in TPM, bared her mid drift in AOTC, and matronly outfits suitable for a pregnant mother in ROTS. (The same with Princess Leia in OT.) Other women, like Kotor II's Darth Traya, are fully clothed, and frankly you wouldn't want to see her in a cat suit anyway.

Men, on the other hand, don't have the same outfit variety. If you're a guy in Star Wars, it's expected that you will be wearing:

A. Armor
B. Jedi/Sith/politician's robes
C. Smuggler's attire, meaning pants, shirt, and a possibly cape.

It's not say that there aren't any female fanservice moments out there, like Cade Skywalker wearing a speedo in Legacy comics. But generally, guys are fully clothed. Not really sexy.

Bringing back to my original point, I'm wondering if the Mara Jade cat suit reflects the culture we live in. Girls are generally portrayed rather vamp-y while guys generally aren't. I don't think the different portrayal is inherently sexist, just completely unnecessary. After all, that's entire point of fanservice. I don't think the catsuit image belongs on a female clothing company, though. Mara Jade Skywalker will still inspire girls whether she's wearing Jedi robes - or not.

Discuss.
_________________
Observation: Life would be cooler if everyone spoke like HK-47.

Communications Coordinator at EUCantina.


Last edited by Dancelittleewok on Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:44 am; edited 1 time in total


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:28 am Reply with quote  
Message
  Dog-Poop_Walker
Master
Master

Joined: 28 Jan 2012
Posts: 1022
Location: Official Med. Grove Troublemaker

I'm a little confused about what exactly we are talking about here. Are you talking about a mara jade costume for a person to wear, or the costume that mara jade would wear as depicted on a piece of clothing, say a t-shirt?

I guess it comes down to the fact that for better or worse, a cat suited Mara Jade is one that is most iconic for that character. A Jedi Robe is intended to be humble and anonymous and it does that.

But in general I totally feel you. The overall lack of costume variety in SW is just laziness. I talked about it in my post for Dawn of the Jedi.

Many of the female depictions are purely male sexual fantasy fulfillment. BDSM Leia, hello? This is a PG movie George! Middriff-ripped-away-shirt Padme is just as bad.

Although not specifically about SW, here's a real good article from Comics Alliance that talks about the unnecessary and one-sided "sexiness" in comics.

http://www.comicsalliance.com/2012/02/16/superheroine-sex-art-story/[/url]

I also think Adam Hughes, whose artwork is shown in the link you posted, is a huge ***hole. But that's another subject.


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:09 am Reply with quote  
Message
  Life Is The Path
Master
Master

Joined: 10 Sep 2010
Posts: 3946
Location: In a galaxy far, far - No, I'm behind you! Got you! Boo!

Speaking towards outfit variety, I think that's down to the not-altogether-incorrect belief that women are more interested in fashion. Thinking about my friends, there are a lot more women interested in fashion than men, in my circle, and I think my male friends are pretty diverse in their interests.

Anyhoo, moving on to the actual topic. No, I don't think a cat-suit is necessary at all. Sadly, I think, as Walker says, the image of Mara in said suit is more well-known than Mara in Jedi garb and because of that that image will win out over perhaps a more up-to-date depiction.

Quickly, when you think of Mara, what do you imagine? I'd be willing to bet that for the most part, if you're caught unaware, then you'll imagine the cat-suit. It more rapidly comes to mind, because it's been overdone.
_________________
I am a Star Wars fan. That doesn't mean that I hate or love Jar Jar. That doesn't mean I hate or love Lucas, or agree or disagree 100% with him. That doesn't mean I prefer the PT over the OT, or vice versa. That doesn't mean I hate the EU, or even love all of it (or even read all of it). These are not prerequisites. Being a man is not a prerequisite. Being a geek is not a prerequisite. The only prerequisite is that I love something about Star Wars. I am a Star Wars fan.


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:19 am Reply with quote  
Message
  Dancelittleewok
EUC Staff
EUC Staff

Joined: 15 Sep 2010
Posts: 1170
Location: Kansas

Dog Poop_Walker wrote:
Are you talking about a mara jade costume for a person to wear, or the costume that mara jade would wear as depicted on a piece of clothing, say a t-shirt?


I'm speaking about the latter.

Dog Poop_Walker wrote:
The overall lack of costume variety in SW is just laziness.


The reason I brought men vs. women costumes different isn't only variety, but generally women are portrayed sexier than men. Padawan Obi-Wan Kenobi is fully clothed. Padawan Ahsoka Tano wears bikini top and pants. Darth Talon wears a bikini. Darth Malgus wears full armor. Looking at Star Wars costumes, I can't help but wonder if the Mara Jade catsuit is just a part of that overall trend.

I'm gonna read the Comic Alliance article this morning. Looks good so far.

Life is the Path wrote:
Speaking towards outfit variety, I think that's down to the not-altogether-incorrect belief that women are more interested in fashion.


That's a good point I hadn't thought of. Smile

Life is the Path wrote:
Sadly, I think, as Walker says, the image of Mara in said suit is more well-known than Mara in Jedi garb and because of that that image will win out over perhaps a more up-to-date depiction.


That makes sense. Looking at her Wookieepedia page, it's hard to find Mara in anything but the infamous catsuit.

Shameless plug: Nanci speaks about the catsuit issue in the latest episode of Tosche Station Radio.
_________________
Observation: Life would be cooler if everyone spoke like HK-47.

Communications Coordinator at EUCantina.


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 9:15 am Reply with quote  
Message
  SidiousThrawn
Knight
Knight

Joined: 07 Feb 2012
Posts: 358
Location: USA

I think females are depicted showing more skin because the creaters may feel that men like SW more than women. Plus, most of the designers are men.
_________________
"Study art...", said Thrawn.

"Vote for Papa Palpatine".


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:50 am Reply with quote  
Message
  Reepicheep
Master
Master

Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 6899
Location: Sailing into the unknown

The depiction of women is probably my biggest (only?) gripe with Star Wars. It boasts strong female characters, but then lets them wear as little as possible so that fanboys can goggle.

The Quinlan Vos omnibus is the only Star Wars book, comic etc. that I threw down with disgust and refused to finish. It was just so absurd. Here you have a character, Aayla Secura, who was manipulated by her uncle and essentially lived her early life as a sex slave. She gets freed and becomes a Jedi. It should be a powerful moment, but we soon see her, as a Jedi, still clothed in a ridiculous skintight outfit. I couldn't read any more, it was just so stupid. I can't possibly connect emotionally with this garbage.

It's a large part of the reason I don't generally read Star Wars comics. I swear the plotlines are devised based on how the female characters will get in a certain situation so they'll be able to look sexy. I'm serious. Read any number of comics and you'll see it. Do the creators of the comics want to take a passionate stance against slavery or do they deal with slavery so much because they know they can get their female characters in costumes following the legacy of the golden bikini. Hu-hyuk.

*headdesk*
_________________

Where sky and water meet,
Where the waves grow sweet,
Doubt not, Reepicheep,
To find all you seek,
There is the utter east.


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:18 pm Reply with quote  
Message
  Darth Skuldren
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: 04 Feb 2008
Posts: 6520
Location: Missouri

Last night I was looking over the Star Wars comic Union. Mara wheres a lot of clothing there that isn't a catsuit. But then she wasn't in combat mode in that series. My observation would be that Jedi robes are too cumbersome for combat. Beneath the robes, Jedi wear tunics and slacks, which you seem Anakin and Obi-Wan wearing in the PT. I have to admit that they really do need to spend more time giving the characters more believable clothing.

Now searching Wookieepedia, I did come across the Choices of One PB cover.


I wouldn't categorize that as a catsuit, and it does sport some body armor. However, it still looks too tight to allow freedom of movement.
_________________

"I believe toys resonate with us as humans, we can hold them them, it's tactile, real! They are totems for our extended beliefs and imaginations. A fetish for ideas that hold as much interest and passion as old religious relics for some. We display them in our homes. They show who we are. They are signals for similar thinking people. A way we connect with each other...and I guess thats why I do toys. That connection." -Ashley Wood


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:33 pm Reply with quote  
Message
  SidiousThrawn
Knight
Knight

Joined: 07 Feb 2012
Posts: 358
Location: USA

As a female, I believe that women can be sexy without being in skin-tight clothes!! Mara Jade sould be shown in the Jedi Tunic not a catsuit as the tightness would restrict movement because, skin-tight suits do not stretch.
_________________
"Study art...", said Thrawn.

"Vote for Papa Palpatine".


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 12:38 pm Reply with quote  
Message
  DannikJerriko
EUC Staff
EUC Staff

Joined: 09 Nov 2011
Posts: 1230
Location: Nirn

Well, Maul is topless a lot. So is Kit Fisto. I do know what you mean though, but apart from the gold bikini, Leia (portrayed as and indeed, is, the strongest, most intelligent respectable character in SW) is pretty much always moderate like her Princess robes in ANH, her Rebel trooper gear in RotJ. There does tend to be a lack of variety, but all of the guys do wear tight fitting clothes (save for the Jedi, but Adi Gallia is always in robes) but all of the spacers are wearing skin-tight suits. And all of the guys are stereotyped into having massive bulky muscles. Maybe men don't dress sexily, but the all have unrealistically big muscles. Cade, Vilmarh, Kit, Maul, Lando, all of the spacers and people you see in bars. But yes, most female characters do dress somewhat skimpily.
_________________
There's always a bigger fish - Qui Gon Jinn.

You shall learn that history is an intricate weaving of many events. No one thing can be understood without the proper context.

The best techniques are passed on by the survivors.


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 10:41 am Reply with quote  
Message
  JediMara77
EUC Staff
EUC Staff

Joined: 14 Apr 2011
Posts: 106
Location: Disney World

I wouldn't mind the catsuit if it were actually what she was described as wearing in the book.

There are some images of her I like in the catsuit. So I'm not a total hater. I just hate the voluptuous, over-sexed images. That's not who she is.
_________________
“You are greater than the Jedi of the former days. Because unlike the Knights of old, Jedi Luke Skywalker…you are not afraid of the dark.”


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website

 PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:26 am Reply with quote  
Message
  Dancelittleewok
EUC Staff
EUC Staff

Joined: 15 Sep 2010
Posts: 1170
Location: Kansas

Thanks to everyone that contributed to this thread!

What do you think is the solution here? How would you like your characters depicted?
_________________
Observation: Life would be cooler if everyone spoke like HK-47.

Communications Coordinator at EUCantina.


View user's profile Send private message

 PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 12:27 pm Reply with quote  
Message
  Reepicheep
Master
Master

Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 6899
Location: Sailing into the unknown

I think it depends on the character. Female Jedi need to wear Jedi robes. Especially in the Old Order with the no attachments rule. Expecting young Jedi males to control their hormones with Jedi like Aayla and Ahsoka walking around is absurd. I can see certain characters dressing like J-Lo, but it's way over done. Like I said earlier, I think the motive behind the prominence of slavery in Star Wars is not from a strong anti-slavery sentiment but a want to show skin.
_________________

Where sky and water meet,
Where the waves grow sweet,
Doubt not, Reepicheep,
To find all you seek,
There is the utter east.


View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website

 PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:44 pm Reply with quote  
Message
  SidiousThrawn
Knight
Knight

Joined: 07 Feb 2012
Posts: 358
Location: USA

Dancelittleewok wrote:
Thanks to everyone that contributed to this thread!

What do you think is the solution here? How would you like your characters depicted?


For the Jedi, they need to be featured as strong, loyal and, determined. Costumes-robes and tunics for males and females.

Sith: mysterious, determined, strong, crafty, always looking out for #1: Sith robes and battle gear.
_________________
"Study art...", said Thrawn.

"Vote for Papa Palpatine".


View user's profile Send private message

Re: Mara Jade Catsuit: Fanservice run amok?
 PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:11 pm Reply with quote  
Message
  illogicalRogue2
Administrator
Administrator

Joined: 01 Sep 2009
Posts: 2854
Location: ....last know presence was near the Tingel Arm..

Dancelittleewok wrote:

Bringing back to my original point, I'm wondering if the Mara Jade cat suit reflects the culture we live in. Girls are generally portrayed rather vamp-y while guys generally aren't. I don't think the different portrayal is inherently sexist, just completely unnecessary. After all, that's entire point of fanservice. I don't think the catsuit image belongs on a female clothing company, though. Mara Jade Skywalker will still inspire girls whether she's wearing Jedi robes - or not.

Discuss.


I honestly think people are blowing the "cat suit" out of proportion. I mean it's Mara Jade- a character who wore the thing for far too long as it was. I mean look at Corran Horn- he's been a Jedi for HOW LONG and all we get are him in Pilot fatigues. It would seem that that time frame is when he was most popular. Most of Mara's images have her in the suit, and she IIRC has mentioned why she liked the suit in one of the novels- IICR it was the functionality / flexibility she had in it.

Now as for Her Universe; I guess it would depend on the image. I'd be perfectly fine with the Choices of One cover.
One of the better Mara images IMO

Which I'd figure Club Jade would endorse since it's their twitter avatar currently. But is it more that the females are scantly dressed? Or that the men are not? I mean I hear complaints going different directions on this topic. To me it's more of the annoying- stop giving us the same character wearing the same outfit over and over and over again. I mean how many outfits has Ahsoka worn and we only have 2 different action figures of her, and even those are almost 100% clones of each other.

I do think though that more strong female characters should be repped more. Viszla- how many can bet that there will be VERY FEW of those figures popping up on shelves. I want one. Heck I want 2- one for me and one for my daughter- Secura- not enough made. Barris- and her master - same thing- Yaddle- I mean it's not like we don't HAVE the characters out there. Someone just thinks they won't sell. But some one also thinks the podracers will..... EPIC FAIL if you ask me.
_________________

-Bring on your thousands, one at a time or all in a rush. I don't give a damn. None shall pass.
-
-To become a Jedi, it is not the Force one must learn to control but oneself.
-
-Podcasts: Star Wars Beyond the Films, The Star Wars Report, & EUCast


View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger

 PostPosted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:39 pm Reply with quote  
Message
  Cerrinea
Master
Master

Joined: 09 Jun 2009
Posts: 1491

Personally, I'd like to wipe everything about Sacrifice from my mind, and while I agree that the Mara image is a good one, it wasn't for her age. She was 57 for pete's sake. Leia gets age appropriate (and dignified cover images), but not Mara. That, imo, is pandering.
_________________
Roqoo Depot co-founder.


View user's profile Send private message

Post new topic   Reply to topic    The EUCantina Forums Forum Index » The Expanded Universe: Literature & Media

Page 1 of 2
All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next

Display posts from previous:

  

Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
Jedi Knights 2 by Scott Stubblefield