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A call for civility in Star Wars fandom
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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:14 pm Reply with quote  
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  Cerrinea
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Well, you'll probably look like a bigger ass on facebook. Very Happy
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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:21 pm Reply with quote  
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  Nedara
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I'd have called myself even worse things if I did such things. My point is that, as long as we are behind a screen, only one thing can prevent such behavior: it's respect. And, unfortunatelly, it seems to be running shorter every day.


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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:45 pm Reply with quote  
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  Cerrinea
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I see your point, but for some reasons things are more civil on facebook. The thing is with a public figure you're posts are very public. So in a way it doesn't matter what name you're posting as, it's public. You can't send messages on a public facebook pages so it's all out there for everyone to see.

Now you can be very uncivil on a personal page, but first of all, you have to be friended to comment which makes you less anonymous right there. Presumably you are some kind of friend. And what's friended can always be unfriended.
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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 1:50 pm Reply with quote  
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  Nedara
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You are quite right. But people can be banned from forums, too. And they don't care.

I believe it's just a matter of time before they begin to behave just like in the forums. And I don't think they change at all what they say in their blogs.


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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:24 pm Reply with quote  
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  Reepicheep
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Youtube is the place you have to watch out for. People eat each other alive on there. Confused
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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:52 pm Reply with quote  
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  illogicalRogue2
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YodaBauer2442 wrote:
I didn't get the feeling like it was really a problem on TOS. Sure, some folks complained about TCW and had little good to say. But they rarely posted. Honestly there was a strong contingent of posters who were absolutely loved TCW and hardly posted anywhere else. We TCW fans we left alone. The only thread that really bashed anything was the fan reactions thread in the EU forum. And that was usually just outbursts after they changed Ryloth and such.

Nothing worse than anything said anywhere else. Less so even.


I agree- as someone who enjoyed bantering about things both EU and TCW I found that many would vent and then the "Pro TCW- and ONLY TCW and Films" crews would come in and turn it into a "you hate TCW" thing which wasn't the point of the discussions in the first place.


People like Emp and myself can see both sides of it, yet if we discuss it at all we're always being told we're negative or to get over it- those saying this need to ALSO realize - it's SW there's nothing to get over. It'll be this way for a couple more decades.

People get frustrated but the end of the day the current set up and collisions are all caused by George- he set up the EU to work as it is, and he's the one making waves. (yes as is his priority- but as fans we do get to discuss what we enjoy and dislike. But some fans want every fan to love every aspect of it in the way that they do- and this is what is wrong with fandom.

When people say that they "refuse to agree to disagree about ANYTHING" these kinds of fans to me are just stirring the pot if they are only going out of their way to start arguments or debates but refuse to agree to disagree of to be open to more POVs then their own- it's THIS sense of entitlement that fosters the other kind that drives IMO all fans nuts.

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LivingJediDream wrote:
I tend to find the most irritating fans within the Expanded Universe circles are the ones that style themselves as experts and lecture on what is and isn't canon. Especially ones like this guy you mentioned that try to pass off their opinions as "canon." There's someone like that at the TOR forums.


And it never works- cause we have had to unlearn so much stuff it makes keeping track of what is and is not a part of the canon anymore confusing. I am a continuity buff- but no where near the level of say Mr. Butler.

I have said WTForce? George a few times- but as Life and Dream know- I'm not going to get so anal about it that it ruins SW for me- in fact I'm more the opposite- I've always been for the good retcons- I go WTForce George when the senseless ones happen.

And that's mainly for the standpoint that I love almost every SW book and comic- as well as the TV shows and games- and I'd LOVE to know George did too.

But beyond that - it works as it always has.

Heck as I've said I had only signed that petition only cause I felt "Why not" and "What's the worst that could happen?" - what is the worst? To me other fans could use it to name call and label those who signed- oh wait that happened- so there's nothing worse to worry about. But to those name callers I ask= did the petition REALLY THREATEN YOU THAT MUCH TO CALL NAMES?.....
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 PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:11 pm Reply with quote  
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  Alan Skywalker V
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Ouch. I've seen some of this too. Not just on TOS, but other, non SW places as well. I registered on Ultimate Disney about two years ago, and after I made a couple of posts there, I got jumped on.

Got involved in a political discussion, and after I made a post, another poster jumped all over me. He was a troublemaker anyhow, but it still annoyed me no end.


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 PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:18 am Reply with quote  
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  Life Is The Path
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Cerrinea wrote:
forumers did call him on it, but why would anyone want to put up with that nonsense when they don't have to.


To be fair, it's not as if we were just sitting around, waiting for someone to act like a ***** so that we could have an old fashioned cantina fight. We don't want it, but we kind of have to put up with it because of the better things that come along. Like talking to Sue Rostoni, Drew Karpyshyn, Leland Chee, John Miller and the like.
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 PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:21 pm Reply with quote  
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  Dunc
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Thanks, guys. I'm glad to see so many people understood what I was trying to say with the post, and that it has been generally well-received. (So far, anyway.)

Fan 'wars' suck in a particularly nasty (and ultimately pointless) way. I have not always been the nicest person in fandom, and I have done the 'basher' thing. (Before it was cool! Hell, before the PT! So very Hipster Ariel of me. CALL ME HELVETICA. Ahem.) It's easy to lose perspective when you're so deeply invested in something. And yeah, when you're 16 and just discovered the internet.

I see no problem with ranting out your frustrations. It's just, there are better places to do it than a public forum in front of everyone, including (possibly, and in my case years and years back, definitely) the object of it. Hate begets hate, you catch more flies with sugar, etc etc.

I'm not sure Facebook will solve all the issues, though - one of the smaller local papers around here uses Facebook Connect for comments, and people still post stuff along the lines of the absolute dumbest, rudest comments we've seen in fandom. Though at least fandom can string sentences together, mostly.


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 PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:12 am Reply with quote  
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  illogicalRogue2
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It reminds me of my old "Do you even LIKE Star Wars" blog post from last June.

You have to wonder if it'll be like this forever- since new teens are discovering the net for their first time daily. Laughing
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 PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:26 am Reply with quote  
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  YodaBauer2442
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Life Is The Path wrote:
This is very interesting. Let me just recall something that happened over at TOS right before it was announced it was shutting down. Do you remember TheRealYoda77?


Hahaha TRY! I think Milo is the one who will miss him the most! Imagine if that guy realized he was being talked about elsewhere. I remember how me made threads titled "A" through "P" and left because he was called a troll. Memories.
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 PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 3:10 am Reply with quote  
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  Life Is The Path
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Dunc wrote:
Thanks, guys. I'm glad to see so many people understood what I was trying to say with the post, and that it has been generally well-received. (So far, anyway.)

Fan 'wars' suck in a particularly nasty (and ultimately pointless) way. I have not always been the nicest person in fandom, and I have done the 'basher' thing. (Before it was cool! Hell, before the PT! So very Hipster Ariel of me. CALL ME HELVETICA. Ahem.) It's easy to lose perspective when you're so deeply invested in something. And yeah, when you're 16 and just discovered the internet.

I see no problem with ranting out your frustrations. It's just, there are better places to do it than a public forum in front of everyone, including (possibly, and in my case years and years back, definitely) the object of it. Hate begets hate, you catch more flies with sugar, etc etc.

I'm not sure Facebook will solve all the issues, though - one of the smaller local papers around here uses Facebook Connect for comments, and people still post stuff along the lines of the absolute dumbest, rudest comments we've seen in fandom. Though at least fandom can string sentences together, mostly.


As stupid as this makes me look, I hadn't realised it was you who wrote that!

Yes, I agree. You can dislike something all you want, and disagree, certainly. But hate is a wasteful, ruining emotion. There's no point bowing to it so much that it ruins what, perhaps, once was a favoured universe.
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I am a Star Wars fan. That doesn't mean that I hate or love Jar Jar. That doesn't mean I hate or love Lucas, or agree or disagree 100% with him. That doesn't mean I prefer the PT over the OT, or vice versa. That doesn't mean I hate the EU, or even love all of it. These are not prerequisites. Being a man is not a prerequisite. Being a geek is not a prerequisite. The only prerequisite is that I love something about Star Wars. I am a Star Wars fan.

Life is like the Force - Luke Skywalker, Crucible. Damn straight I am.


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 PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 3:11 am Reply with quote  
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  Life Is The Path
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YodaBauer2442 wrote:
Life Is The Path wrote:
This is very interesting. Let me just recall something that happened over at TOS right before it was announced it was shutting down. Do you remember TheRealYoda77?


Hahaha TRY! I think Milo is the one who will miss him the most! Imagine if that guy realized he was being talked about elsewhere. I remember how me made threads titled "A" through "P" and left because he was called a troll. Memories.


I know! And on P, there was about 5 pages of people saying 'don't go! I'll miss you! I feel sad now *sniffles*' Laughing
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I am a Star Wars fan. That doesn't mean that I hate or love Jar Jar. That doesn't mean I hate or love Lucas, or agree or disagree 100% with him. That doesn't mean I prefer the PT over the OT, or vice versa. That doesn't mean I hate the EU, or even love all of it. These are not prerequisites. Being a man is not a prerequisite. Being a geek is not a prerequisite. The only prerequisite is that I love something about Star Wars. I am a Star Wars fan.

Life is like the Force - Luke Skywalker, Crucible. Damn straight I am.


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