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Episode VII in 2015 [spoiler thread]
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 PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:54 am Reply with quote  
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  Dancelittleewok
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Louisee wrote:
For example: Ray without any training, beats a powerful Dark Jedi or Sith Apprentice or whatever in a lightsaber duel.


3 possibilities:
1) She was mind-wiped Jacen style
2) drugged with midichlorians
3) Skywalker

I kinda hope she's the new villain (even though that would totally fly in the face of her character) because Kylo Ren was such a disappointment. He fails every mission. He lacks self-confidence. He truly is Darth Emo.

AND HE KILLED HAN SOLO

I think that's the real reason why he was beaten by a noob -- for fangirl retribution. After killing my favorite character, Kylo Ren just needed to be taken down a notch. Well, that's how it feels anyways at 4:48 AM....

More thoughts when I'm semi-coherent.
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 PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 9:20 am Reply with quote  
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  Mara Jade Skywalker
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Dancelittleewok wrote:
He truly is Darth Emo.


Darth Emo, or Darth Elmo? Both are appropriate.
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 PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 7:56 pm Reply with quote  
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  Caedus_16
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I think Kylo Ren is the most layered, interesting villain we've had in a Star Wars movie...

Not the coolest, nor the most powerful. Just the most interesting. Thought I'd make that clear.
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 PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:45 am Reply with quote  
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  DarthMRN
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Wow. Ackbar's voice actor just died. Damn was that some epic timing on TFA's part.
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 PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:10 pm Reply with quote  
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  Skywalker2B
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Dancelittleewok wrote:
Louisee wrote:
For example: Ray without any training, beats a powerful Dark Jedi or Sith Apprentice or whatever in a lightsaber duel.


3 possibilities:
1) She was mind-wiped Jacen style
2) drugged with midichlorians
3) Skywalker

I kinda hope she's the new villain (even though that would totally fly in the face of her character) because Kylo Ren was such a disappointment. He fails every mission. He lacks self-confidence. He truly is Darth Emo.

AND HE KILLED HAN SOLO

I think that's the real reason why he was beaten by a noob -- for fangirl retribution. After killing my favorite character, Kylo Ren just needed to be taken down a notch.


Here's something I wrote up a couple months ago...

Concerning the level of force power between Rey and Ben...

In Episode 1, we learn about the Midichlorians. We learn that everyone has them. The number of Midi's in a person determines their strength in the force and whether or not they would be trained as a jedi. We learn that not everyone gets tested though. We learn that Anakin has the highest known count of them. Anakin, with Padme (it's unknown if she was tested, but the AotC novel had Yoda make a comment that the force was strong with Padme), have Luke and Leia. It could also be possible that Padme was tested and eligible, but either turned it down or it was already determined that she would go into politics and become royalty. There's been nothing to support this next idea, but here it goes...

Maybe a person could have some midi's, but never "use" them to tap into the force, or that they don’t have enough to be able to. The midi's would just remain dormant, un-exercised, less powerful so to speak.

Let's assume that Luke and Leia have equal midi levels. Luke eventually uses his midi's to tap into the force, thus exercising them making them stronger. Leia...doesn't. At least, not much. There are only two times when she appears to use the force...1. on the Falcon to sense Luke in distress and 2. on Endor to sense that Luke is ok after the DS explodes. It may be possible that she does do some jedi training with Luke after RotJ, but that hasn't been revealed yet. We do know that, sometime before TFA, she goes back to the military and only shows force sense when Han dies.

So, shortly after RotJ, Leia marries Han and they have Ben. Han doesn’t have enough midi's, or at least barely any, so Ben only gets some useful midi's from his mother...who's midi's were somewhat dormant/unexercised/less powerful. However, considering that they originate from Anakin still have a strong potential...with lots of training.

Now you have Luke's offspring. Assuming that my idea about the Kenobi connection is close and Luke has a child with the daughter of Kenobi, Rey's mother would also have a fair amount of midi's to combine with Luke's. So, Rey's midi's are more in count, not dormant, exercised, powerful giving her huge potential force power. Essentially, we’d learn that two parents with higher count/stronger midi’s (ie. Jedi) would produce children stronger in the force than would only one parent strong in the force.

Perhaps Rey could figure this out and encourage force strong people (ie. jedi) to marry and procreate in order to build a stronger jedi order?

I think you can see where I'm leading here. Could this be a valid justification for what we see in TFA?


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 PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:30 pm Reply with quote  
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  Caedus_16
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DarthMRN wrote:
Wow. Ackbar's voice actor just died. Damn was that some epic timing on TFA's part.


Yeah I think that's also why they had John Williams rush the soundtrack right at the end. Some of the actors are getting up there in years, they want to include everyone they can for as long as they can.

Also....sad day. Ackbar died.
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 PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:54 pm Reply with quote  
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  Taral-DLOS
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Caedus_16 wrote:
DarthMRN wrote:
Wow. Ackbar's voice actor just died. Damn was that some epic timing on TFA's part.


Yeah I think that's also why they had John Williams rush the soundtrack right at the end. Some of the actors are getting up there in years, they want to include everyone they can for as long as they can.

Also....sad day. Ackbar died.


I heard someone joke once that they made Mark Hamill lose a bunch of weight for his silent few seconds in Episode VII just to help make sure he stays alive at least until they finish filming Episode VIII and/or IX.
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 PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:08 pm Reply with quote  
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  DarthMRN
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Skywalker2B wrote:
I think you can see where I'm leading here. Could this be a valid justification for what we see in TFA?


I can see why the people behind the movie might think so, but the opposite is implied by the Lucasverse.

"The Emperor knew, as I did, that if Anakin were to have any offspring, they would be a threat to him".

"The son of Skywalker must not become a Jedi. He could destroy us".

"The Force is strong in your family. Your father has it. You have it. Your sister has it".


I'm paraphrasing, as I can't be bothered to look up the exact wording right now. But I see no way of interpreting this evidence without reaching the conclusion that the Jedi and Sith Masters can predict with some certainty that being part of Ani's bloodline will make someone as powerful as himself.

Even accepting that Padme had some Force sensitivity, her genetic contribution to Luke and Leia's Force potential is unlikely to have been great. Certainly no more than some run of the mill Jedi. So for her children to still have enough Chosen One potential to not only be a threat to the midi-born Vader and the Emperor, but indeed beat the former in his reduced state in spite of decades of difference in Force training, we have to assume it doesn't work like that. That any generational reduction resulting from muggle parents is marginal.

The first quote also prevents mere genetic coincidence from producing a weak Skywalker heir.

And that is not even mentioning Han and his Bad Feeling, and the fact that Leia can feel his death through the Force at all. I doubt his midi count is quite at muggle level himself. So what maybe goes for Padme maybe goes for him too.


I'd be willing to accept Rey being stronger than Ren by a moderate margin, provided a Force-strong mother. But not the level of difference implied by TFA. No way. That was Vader vs Luke-level, without the Lucasverse justification.
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 PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 5:20 pm Reply with quote  
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  Reepicheep
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Dancelittleewok wrote:
I kinda hope she's the new villain (even though that would totally fly in the face of her character) because Kylo Ren was such a disappointment. He fails every mission. He lacks self-confidence. He truly is Darth Emo.

That's an interesting idea actually. Rey should at least have some serious dark side issues in Episode VIII because I still feel like her learning to use the Force so fast flies in the face of everything Yoda taught in ESB - that mastering the Force takes training, discipline, and patience and that the quick and easy path is the dark side. That idea's really important to me. If Rey would become the villain does that mean Kylo Ren would become the hero? There is also the much-discussed possibility that Rey had previous training, but has lost her memory of it. So the Force, along with her memories, were "awakening" in her during TFA. I'd accept that too.

And I agree with Caedus that Kylo Ren is the most layered and interesting villain we've had in the films so far. I enjoyed watching him the most in my second viewing. The tradeoff is that, after the events of TFA, he feels like one of the least threatening villains we've had.
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 PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 5:58 pm Reply with quote  
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  DarthMRN
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Hell, Rey flirting with the dark side, forcing Ben into the position of uneasy protagonist would be a good way of justifying him getting beaten during round 1. If he isn't a villain for the hero to work herself up to, but the eventual underdog, that could work.

She really doesn't seem like the type, though. That would be a curveball for sure.

EDIT: Okay, I just watched the TFA duel again, and what I noticed is that when Rey goes Force mode on Ben she really does look like she is joined by the dark side instead. While there isn't screaming anger or nothing, she gets a lot more aggressive, invoking Anakin's brutal fighting style while gritting her teeth and panting.
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 PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 11:51 am Reply with quote  
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  DarthMRN
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5Iv_sazoGg&t=30m30s
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 PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 12:34 pm Reply with quote  
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  Mara Jade Skywalker
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Mark is great. Listen to 18:25. You would think Harrison was there.
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 PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 11:25 pm Reply with quote  
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  Jaina Solo Fel
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Aaand now I just watched the whole interview... Laughing

And you're right, his Harrison impression is spot on.
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 PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 5:05 pm Reply with quote  
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  Reepicheep
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Anyone catch the drama about Rey's parents over the past couple days?

J. J. Abrams was quoted as saying:

J. J. Abrams wrote:
Rey’s parents are not in Episode VII. So I can’t possibly say in this moment who they are. But I will say it is something that Rey thinks about, too.


After an internet storm, he later clarified:

J. J. Abrams wrote:
What I meant was that she doesn’t discover them in Episode VII. Not that they may not already be in her world.


I still think (and hope) it's Luke.
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 PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:26 am Reply with quote  
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  DarthMRN
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Pfeh.
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